Does anyone find themselves... hiding??

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Willow
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Post by Willow » Mon Apr 30, 2007 7:06 am

thanks, I just kind of pooped that out but it might be true.....
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
Dr. Seuss (1904 - 1991)

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Post by fatale » Fri May 11, 2007 5:54 am

I'm not hiding anymore, but I'm not as boisterous about my religion as I was when I first came out of the broom closet!
For a while I was decorated with pentacles and different gems - gosh, I looked like a modern movie witch! :lol:

I began to understand - just as I don't want anybody else to "rub in" their believes, other people don't want me to "rub in" mine!

So, I wear my pentacle necklace (a small one) but most of the time it's under my shirt now. (we also have this rule at work, no religious signs at the work place) I take it out when I leave work. If somebody asks me about my religion, I answer truthfully and try to explain the "I'm not a satanist" part!
If people get to know you as a person they most likely will not be "turned off" by you because you worship different god/desses thant they do! Even our catholic receptionist (the one who asks me about going to church) doesn't judge. Actually, she wants me to read her cards! :) Though, I think she is happy I believe in something and I'm bot an atheist! :lol:

Maybe that's not true for everybody, but I think many young witches start out just for the "shock value" of the religion. If they stay with it, they will learn that there is much more to wicca/pagan than pentacles and wand waving - being balanced and live in harmonie with the world - including the other human inhabitants! Even if that means to "hide" sometimes.

ooops! rant! :o

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Post by Kitsune » Fri May 11, 2007 7:41 am

Ok, so I said I wasn't hiding anymore... and apparently I lied. :-? :-(

I was at my best friend, Jenn's house, and she made the comment, "Remember when you were in high school and were making power symbols and casting spells... boy were you naive!"

And I was so astounded by her ignorance of my beliefs, that I stayed quiet, trying to think about how to tell her that I still do this without sounding silly. :oops:

I want to correct her, but we don't talk about religion... she knows I'm pagan, and I guess to her that's just another way of saying I worship a god, and that's all it is to her.

Is it important that I tell her? She'd accept me either way, but is it worth the misunderstandings, the long drawn out conversation (which will start to sound like conversion if I insist that she understand any of it), and the look in her eyes of "Wacko!" :-?

Grrrrrr. I hate this. I feel like I should tell her, but at the same time, she'd just scoff and laugh at it, while wondering if she needs to get me professional help. Any advice?
Trying to create a world, even in words, is good occupational therapy for lunatics who think they're God, and an excellent argument for Polytheism. -S.M. Stirling

http://www.bamatthews.comThe Writings and Musings of B.A. Matthews

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Jescissa
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Post by Jescissa » Fri May 11, 2007 11:49 am

Kitsune wrote:"Remember when you were in high school and were making power symbols and casting spells... boy were you naive!"
I've had that from a few friends too. And I decided that if they were going to take it so lightly, they didn't need to know how I really feel about my faith. I was serious about it in school and I'm serious about it now and if my friends don't see that in me, then there's no point in opening a can of worms.

At least you didn't agree with her to make her happy, although I probably would have stayed quiet like that too, it's embarrassing to realise that your friends thought you were naive and a dork at school for your faith. I had a strong lion totem while I was at school and while I was trying to make sense of these feelings, I naturally spoke to my friends about it. Probably in a bit too much depth, describing feeling like a lioness and such. It took a long time to shake off the 'lion-girl' thing.

If she is just going to scoff, I think she doesn't deserve to know. Faith is a personal thing and you don't have to be in hiding to withold information about yourself. I don't count my being in the broomcloset to certain folks as lying to them.
"If you trust in yourself and believe in your dreams and follow your star...you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy. Goodbye." - Miss Tick, Terry Pratchett's Wee Free Men

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Post by katsu » Sat May 12, 2007 12:41 am

I will concur with Daibanjo here. I won't hide it (anymore), but I won't flaunt it. At my work I've shown an interest in Celtic history first, gradually mentioning the OBOD and finally Druidry and me being a pagan.

As for my family........ My mothers side is fundie. They have no idea, they don't even know of my tattoo's. (it's not done says the bible :lol:) As for my fathers family, my cousin knows; he's told his sisters etc etc.... The only person not told is my Dad.(though he probably knows, those books about Celtic Gods, Paganism and Druidry tend to give it away) But we don't discuss it.
Btw, speaking of tattoo's.....

Image


(set may 2nd)
/|\

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Post by Jescissa » Sun May 13, 2007 9:04 am

Nice tattoo, Katsu! I am not open at all with my family. My parents know, but we never speak of it because the first time I brought it up they thought it was a phase and the second time I brought it up they were disappointed that their Christian beliefs somehow didn't rub off on me (my immediate family never even go to church or really talk about their faith, so it's a surprise to me that they just assumed I'd pick up Christianity from just knowing them!)

I don't consider not talking about my beliefs to be hiding though. Hiding implies some kind of fear, I'm not afraid of their reaction towards me for the beliefs I have, I just want to protect them from having to hold negative feelings about me. I want them to just see me as the little girl they've always loved and known, rather than have that image clouded and have them feeling like I'm some kind of Satanist with a tarnished soul. I love my family and they love me and I don't want them to have to think badly of me because my beliefs and their beliefs are incompatible.
"If you trust in yourself and believe in your dreams and follow your star...you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy. Goodbye." - Miss Tick, Terry Pratchett's Wee Free Men

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Post by Kitsune » Mon May 14, 2007 7:42 am

The problem is that she doesn't consider that stuff part of the faith.

Heck, I tried to explain why having my wedding on Beltane would be awesome, and she just looked at me like I'd grown a second head... even after I finished the conversation with the line, "It's just... a very fortuitous time for a handfasting.".

Mind you, I shouldn't be surprised... We stopped hanging out about 3 years ago, and only in the past year have started reconnecting at all. Damn it, we stopped hanging out because we'd become so different it was becoming hard to talk to each other without getting angry. :cry:

I don't want that to happen again, but I think that we're still just that different... I think that if I'm not going to change (and I know SHE'S not going to change, not that I'd ask her to), I may just have to accept that we're just not best friends anymore... Leave it at "Better than acquaintences, but less than Good friends" sort of level...

Ah well. We're thinking about inviting her and her husband for a camping trip for the summer solstice!!! That should be a good enough introduction to our religion, without the pain of the long drawn out conversation... until afterwards at least. :lol:
Trying to create a world, even in words, is good occupational therapy for lunatics who think they're God, and an excellent argument for Polytheism. -S.M. Stirling

http://www.bamatthews.comThe Writings and Musings of B.A. Matthews

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Post by Arcanum Owl » Mon May 14, 2007 1:07 pm

So know the feeling Kitsune, my best friend whom during high school were pretty much inseparable about 3yrs ago suddenly became a born again Christian. At first I didn't really care, but when he started to preach in my own house and actually started to make WH quite upset I quite simply took him outside. I said quite simply "Mate I have to ask, are you continually talking about Christianity in the hopes of recruiting us or simply trying to convince yourself of your own faith?"
Kinda harsh I must admit, and he was taken back. Before he could say anything though I reminded him that he was the one who once described me as subtle as a thrown brick.

To almost anyone whom bother to ask I say I'm non-religious, by that I mean that there is no recognised religion that fully incorporates all that I believe. Which is pretty darn true. Saying that I'm pagan or wiccan would be a lie not to mention it would immediately tarnish me in peoples eyes with their own misconceptions and the meaning behind those words. I used to claim to be pagan but got extremely tired of explaining myself and after examining certain definitions I realised I wasn't a pagan.

What I fine most interesting about this whole "why should be lie about what we believe" thing is that the answer is usually in the form I'm a Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Taoist, Buhdist, Athenist, Pagan, etc. They are all stereotypes, each one has it's own inbreed superstitions and propaganda rubbish.

Do we really need to define, label and put ourselves in a box for other people to understand?
I'm Arcanum owl, take me, leave me or just get outta my way.

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Post by Ragnar » Tue May 15, 2007 3:53 am

Call of the lesser spotted Born again; "I found Jesus"

Call of the much more spotted Heathen "I did not know he was hidding".

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Post by FyreGarnet » Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:43 pm

I try not to hide my religion with people. Even my family knows, though we don't necessarily talk about it. My fiance obviously knows. I had to tell him, otherwise I couldn't marry him, IMO. He's christian, but he has come to terms with me being pagan. As long as I believe in his God as well as my own, then it's ok. I don't have to worship his God, but I just have to believe in him.

To me it seems a little silly, but as long as we are happy together, it works.

When people ask me about my religion, I tell them straight out. However, if they don't ask, I don't tell. This is not lying to me, except when it is my parents. Though that is slowly changing over time. I'm a grown woman and don't have to confess everything to them anymore.

Thus, I try not to hide my religion. I even wear my ankh openly. And yes they do see it as a very pretty cross. I always have a strange look on my face when they call it by it's rightful name.

Again, this was late, but I thought I'd put my thoughts out there for you all.

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Post by Jescissa » Mon Jul 23, 2007 11:34 pm

FyreGarnet wrote:He's christian, but he has come to terms with me being pagan. As long as I believe in his God as well as my own, then it's ok. I don't have to worship his God, but I just have to believe in him.
Hi, not to pick holes in something that works for you...but I don't see how your fiance has the right to make you believe in something that is outside of your faith. I wonder how he would take it if you said that you don't mind him being Christian as long as he believes in your Gods too? Anyway, if you believe in the God of Israel, He doesn't want you to believe in anything else because He's a jealous God. Christianity is pretty much as incompatible with a Pagan path as you can get!

If people ask I will tell them and answer any questions they might have, if they don't ask, I won't bring it up. My religion is personal and if people don't go out of their way to ask me about it, I won't go out of my way to bring it up! :lol:
"If you trust in yourself and believe in your dreams and follow your star...you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy. Goodbye." - Miss Tick, Terry Pratchett's Wee Free Men

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Post by Windwalker » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:03 am

Jescissa wrote:
FyreGarnet wrote:He's christian, but he has come to terms with me being pagan. As long as I believe in his God as well as my own, then it's ok. I don't have to worship his God, but I just have to believe in him.
Hi, not to pick holes in something that works for you...but I don't see how your fiance has the right to make you believe in something that is outside of your faith. I wonder how he would take it if you said that you don't mind him being Christian as long as he believes in your Gods too? Anyway, if you believe in the God of Israel, He doesn't want you to believe in anything else because He's a jealous God. Christianity is pretty much as incompatible with a Pagan path as you can get!
Well, I agree that Christianity and Paganism are incompatible, but I'd like to put something out there.

As a hard polytheist, I'm of the opinion that there is a god out there called Yahweh. But, I do not believe that he is anything like the way the bible describes him (omnipotent, omniscient, the only god, the creator, etc etc). In all honesty, I tend to imagine him as a little old man, a bit neurotic and completely frazzled by far too many worshippers all arguing and fighting one another and waging holy wars and so forth. I mean, I haven't completely decided to myself that he exists, but the possibility is there, and if he did, that's how I'd imagine he would be. Poor bugger. ;)

So I think you can believe Yahweh exists without having to believe that he's like the way Christians tend to view him. The argument against would be "so what makes him the same god?" and I have no answer for that. *shrug* It would be problematic, and involve much philosophy.
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes

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Post by FyreGarnet » Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:10 am

With regard to the Bible, I see that even though it is supposed to be the word of God, it came through humans and their writing. That can lead to wrongful interpretations, let alone when they are translated. The translations themselves seem to have many errors, for there are usually similar or even the same words for different things.

Both David and I agree upon this and that his God is not the same god that is portrayed in the Bible. Also, just believing in him is not the problem. He does not want you to worship other gods or goddesses. He can be picky and possibly jealous, but he does not, to me, have a problem with someone believing in other gods or even demigods. Some Christians believe in Lucifer and all. He would be considered a demigod if I'm not correct.

At least this is how I see things.

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Post by Kitsune » Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:37 am

I believe that the Christian God has just as much right to a seat on the divine council as Aphrodite or Apollo or Bast or Anubis. All Gods that man worships are out there, they are identifiable and have (to a point) the powers described...

The only thing I'm out on is whether we created them through the act of worship, or if we started worshipping them because they were already there. :lol:

The fact that I don't worship him, but believe that he's out there confuses people... but I take it the same way I take any other deity. I may not worship him, but far be it for me to say he doesn't exist.
Trying to create a world, even in words, is good occupational therapy for lunatics who think they're God, and an excellent argument for Polytheism. -S.M. Stirling

http://www.bamatthews.comThe Writings and Musings of B.A. Matthews

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Post by Kystar » Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:04 am

I'm pretty open...but I hate trying to explain to someone who won't open their mind at all, so I usually don't. I say I follow an Olde Pathe and leave it at that.

I have a co-worker who occasionally makes me want to bang my head off my desk. We got into the subject of religion b/c she asked what church I go to, and I looked at her like she'd lost her mind...eventually explaining that I don't GO to church b/c my faith doesn't require that.

Anyways...every so often, she'll be flipping through a magazine or something on lunch, and see a decoration for a holiday, and want to show me, then backs up and goes "But you don't decorate for this, do you?" For example: You don't have a winter holiday that uses evergreens and red ribbons as part of the decorations, do you, because you don't do Christmas?

Now, the first time she asked this, I politely explained that the decorations for Christmas were, historically, similar (nearly identical) to those for yule, except for the golden sun images sometimes incorporated...therefore and henceforth, I DO decorate with Evergreens, lights and red ribbon! I just don't do the manger scene or the other Christian symbols.

Would you believe that I've explained this about twenty times? I do, but it's gotten to the point where I just roll my eyes. How dense can you be?

Am I hiding? No.
Am I choosing my battles a little more wisely so I don't pop a vein/artery out of frustration? Yes.
You say "Witch" like it's a bad thing!

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